Max Semenchuk: Brad.
Brandon Kelly: Great, thanks.
Max Semenchuk: I'll leave now. I think some people will join in a minute or two, but I wish you a productive conversation.
Brandon Kelly: Thanks, Max, have a great day.
Max Semenchuk: Cheers.
Christian: Hey, friends!
Christian: Let's see, can I hear anybody?
Christian: Brandon.
Brandon Kelly: I can hear you.
Christian: Or somebody said… okay, you can hear me? I can… okay, I heard something there.
Christian: Great.
Christian: I'm… I'm here with Reggie.
Christian: He's eating breakfast, and my daughter's getting dressed, ready to go to… Ready to go to preschool.
Brandon Kelly: I like how Reggie always has a smile, like, ready to knock out
Brandon Kelly: He's, like, waiting for someone to give him a reason.
Christian: Yeah, he's… he's a smiler. He's a happy kid. I do, yeah.
Christian: Yeah, we're pretty… we've been pretty lucky with our kids. They're… they're great. They're,
Christian: Good eaters, good sleepers, generally really positive.
Christian: aren't you?
Brandon Kelly: Who do we got today?
Brandon Kelly: See, it's just me and you.
Christian: Gregory.
Christian: Yeah, okay.
Christian: How's your, there's some… there's, Narthana is here.
Christian: Simone.
Christian: I know, Tana.
narthana arumugam: Hi! I was just kind of, like, interested in your project, and I just wanted to take a look at your, like, meetings.
narthana arumugam: No more. Cool.
Christian: Cool.
Christian: Great. Well, you're certainly welcome to listen in and chime in whenever you want. This is a, you know, open community project. This group, the Tokenomics group, is a group that gets together to try to work on
Christian: In the… at the moment, we're in the midst of a,
Christian: A redesign of our blockchain architecture and our tokenomics to really try to tie together the…
Christian: a functioning tech stack along with the, the regen token, and make sure that the
Christian: Ideally, if our design works well, that the
Christian: the price of the token over time reflects that ecological impact is really happening. I mean, that's one of my main goals with the tokenomics upgrades.
Christian: So…
Christian: Yeah, right now it's kind of loosely tied to it, but we hope to tie it much more closely.
narthana arumugam: Well, that sounds interesting.
Christian: Yeah. Do you… We're still waiting for folks to, to get on the call. Do you have any specific questions or general questions about the project? We'd be happy to…
Christian: Start there before others show up.
narthana arumugam: No, I was kind of just going through all of the, like, projects that you have on board, all of, you know, your community, I was just going through the Discord and stuff, so I just wanted to pop in for a meeting. That's it.
Christian: Cool, cool, sounds good.
narthana arumugam: Reggie!
narthana arumugam: He's really cute.
Christian: Yeah.
Christian: Hi.
Christian: Well, Brandon, how's the, how's your work going with, with NetNet, and, and, kind of learning these tools, and…
Christian: All that.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, the whole weekend, I, and yesterday, I focused on… iterating on… this ginormous…
Brandon Kelly: GitHub. It's going pretty well. I have a pretty cool dev… dev flow.
Brandon Kelly: I…
Christian: huh?
Brandon Kelly: I scope out…
Brandon Kelly: a few things that I find, and I'll feed it in, we'll talk vision and whatnot, and then…
Brandon Kelly: And then we'll plan out a bunch of units.
Brandon Kelly: And then on in.
Brandon Kelly: I'll type in unit number, and then it'll crank out that unit, and then I'll store it.
Brandon Kelly: And then I'll put it in.
Brandon Kelly: to the… into the GitHub, so it's…
Brandon Kelly: It's freak everything I want in an app.
Brandon Kelly: It's, you know, the agent… it's gonna be an agent that can trade.
Brandon Kelly: Retire credits… And run a… run a restaurant, and… Oh, and…
Brandon Kelly: execute on, STGs, you know, Sustainability Development Goals.
Christian: Did you say run a restaurant?
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, my son's.
Christian: putting Bad Bunny on.
Christian: Are you turning Bad Bunny on the speaker?
Brandon Kelly: Sorry, we're gonna have to have a halftime show, Bad Bunny.
Christian: Unfortunately, we have a… well, it's kind of fun for him. We have a speaker on the floor that he's able to reach the…
Christian: So, wings.
Christian: And,
Christian: Yeah. Anyhow, Brandon, that's cool. You know, one of the things I've been running into that's challenging for me with this coding work
Christian: is that… you know, if I was…
Christian: when I've built websites and things using the… using AI,
Christian: it's… it really works for me, because I can build the basic thing, and then go look at it, and try it, and be like, oh yeah, you know what needs to change here? You know, let's change this feature, let's make this look like this, let's… you know, that… that thing didn't work, it didn't actually buy the eco credits and retire them, so what happened there? Let's fix it.
Christian: One of the challenges I've been having with this whole project that, you know, tokenomics adjustment is
Christian: is that I don't have anything concrete to go and test and look at and see, is that what… is that what I'm wanting? I feel like I'm just feeding all this information that we've gathered together into a engine, and then, say, telling the AI, okay.
Christian: You know, go ahead and build this to the best you can.
Christian: And then I have no idea whether it's done it well or not, or whether it's even done it to the specs that it… that is being called out.
Christian: So I feel a little bit lost in this, like, middle world of…
Christian: am I actually get… achieving anything by, you know…
Christian: Watching this, my console run and run and run, and then it says, great, it's done, I tested it, looks good.
Brandon Kelly: Because I'm like, okay.
Brandon Kelly: It probably… it probably is.
Brandon Kelly: It probably is doing…
Brandon Kelly: as hard as it is to believe, it probably is, because that's how I was approaching it as well. Do you have, like, your own little GitHub for.
Lance Pitman: It probably is what?
Lance Pitman: Doing it right.
Lance Pitman: I really strongly disagree.
Christian: Especially if you grab a bottle.
Lance Pitman: Experience.
Christian: That, that didn't have to fit together.
Christian: Yeah.
Lance Pitman: Yeah, I'm coming in late to the conversation, but… so I'm not exactly, exactly sure, but…
Lance Pitman: My experience with building with AI is that it is a very iterative process.
Lance Pitman: that it makes TONS of mistakes.
Lance Pitman: And that you have to, like.
Lance Pitman: Do it piece by piece by piece.
Lance Pitman: And test it, and figure out what's broken, figure out what it broke along the way, fix that.
Lance Pitman: keep adding to it, keep adding to it, keep adding to it. If you just tell it, like, build me this thing, it will, like… it'll tell you, oh, I built it, and it's completely perfect, you're done, hooray, and give you all this, like, applause and everything, and it doesn't even work.
Lance Pitman: At least… at least with some of the apps I've been testing and building and stuff.
Lance Pitman: Especially if you're working with Grok.
Christian: Right.
Brandon Kelly: And some of that process has gotten a lot better, because it will automatically test itself.
Christian: and fix a bunch of the errors. And so it goes through a bunch of cycles, but it's still, at the end, it says, okay, I've done it, and then I still don't have very high confidence that when it says it's done it, that it's actually completed the task. I want to be able to look at it and test it and try it.
Christian: And even if it quote-unquote works.
Christian: I'm sure there's a bunch of things that aren't quite the way that I would have wanted them to be, and I want to be able to… so that… that's… that's my challenge here. It's like.
Christian: It's almost like we need to, like, you know… Spin up a whole…
Christian: Well, obviously, we need to arrive at the specs first, you know? I was gonna say spin up a testnet, but then I'm like.
Christian: Well, what testnet? Are we even gonna do this on… on an iteration of Regen Ledger, or are we gonna…
Christian: Is a bunch of this stuff gonna run on base, or… or… another one of the L2s, or what, you know, where are we at? I think there's a bunch of decisions, specification decisions we gotta make in advance of even that.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah.
Lance Pitman: Yeah, did you see this discussion going on about L2s brought forth by Vitalik?
Christian: Yeah.
Lance Pitman: Vitalik, I don't know how you say his name, but.
Christian: Yeah.
Lance Pitman: Does that have any bearing on your thinking?
Christian: Well, I haven't really been following it very closely, but I've heard some of the people saying that Vitalik is actually basically
Christian: describing the original vision of Cosmos. Now, with his…
Lance Pitman: too.
Christian: So Cosmos is going down, and then Ethereum's gonna just kind of… Become the… the,
Christian: Interconnected, blockchain world.
Christian: So it's interesting.
Lance Pitman: It's so unclear to me if Cosmos is actually going down.
Lance Pitman: Like… Obviously.
Christian: Absolutely.
Lance Pitman: all… Almost all of the projects.
Lance Pitman: that aren't Adam.
Lance Pitman: I mean, obviously, all of it has gone down in value.
Lance Pitman: You know, that we can't, dispute that.
Lance Pitman: But the same thing is… could be said for just about every single crypto project out there.
Lance Pitman: And… You know, with Bitcoin aside, and or, you know, newly launched VC-funded projects.
Lance Pitman: That are, you know, that are going up because they're new, and they're… Playing the game.
Lance Pitman: But, you know… this idea that, like, Adam is gonna, like.
Lance Pitman: die completely? I mean, it's still a billion-dollar chain.
Lance Pitman: like…
Christian: Right.
Lance Pitman: I just don't… I don't know, I… you know, and I've been painting… I was just earlier looking at Neutron.
Lance Pitman: At, like, all the development that they've been doing lately.
Lance Pitman: And it's pretty massive. They have been adding feature after feature after feature after feature to their app, And…
Lance Pitman: getting into all this, you know, BTC-Fi stuff, and like, I just don't think that… These people would be…
Lance Pitman: Continuing to build, and continuing to, like.
Lance Pitman: Do all this stuff if they, like, didn't know something about the longevity of what they're involved in?
Lance Pitman: That's my take on it.
Christian: Yeah, I think you're right. I think there's a role for… especially as the,
Christian: As the bridges have become more, more useful and dependable that…
Christian: the projects built on the Cosmos SDK can still… can still do their thing and still thrive.
Christian: Even if the Ethereum world is the one that ends up dominating the… the, the market share.
Christian: So, yeah, I don't think it's gonna go away, but it certainly has lost its luster, it seems. It's, you know, it's…
Lance Pitman: Yeah, I mean, it's this… it's this weird, sad combination of…
Lance Pitman: market timing on the launch of everything, the implosion of UST, The market in general… And then…
Lance Pitman: you know, that's the way I see it, you know, it's just, like, one thing after another that just… well, and then everything being paired with Osmo…
Lance Pitman: like… It's like…
Lance Pitman: People didn't learn from SushiSwap and PancakeSwap and every other token that got paired with a DEX token.
Lance Pitman: It's like… They were like, oh, no, this time it's gonna work.
Lance Pitman: Because sometimes those tokens did have a huge… I mean, even Osmo, it had a massive run-up. It was just really fast, and, you know, and it was like, holy shit, it just went from $1 to, like, $11.
Lance Pitman: And then it was, like.
Lance Pitman: You know, the never-ending grind down, like, oh, it's gonna come back, it's gonna come back, it's gonna come back, it's gonna come back.
Lance Pitman: I don't know, I just…
Lance Pitman: I just, I, you know, like, I use all these other…
Lance Pitman: apps out there, and I'm just like, God, everything in Cosmos just works so much better.
Lance Pitman: How can it be this way, that it's, like, that it can't attract liquidity?
Lance Pitman: But… I don't know.
Lance Pitman: So, what are you working on building? You're saying you're using AI to spin up, like, a tokenomics… like…
Lance Pitman: Dashboard, or an actual chain, or…
Christian: Well, to be honest, I have been, practicing with these tools, doing other things that are much more clear in my own mind, you know?
Christian: So, like, as of… as of 3 weeks ago, I hadn't really done any…
Christian: vibe coding at all, you know, or any, like, very little…
Christian: develop… like, developer-type work at all, because I'm not a… I'm not a coder, I'm not a… I'm not a builder, I'm not an engineer, right? And… but… but I've been following the… the, process of AI and hearing how it's getting easier and easier and easier, and then…
Christian: some of the people I've been following recently have just been like, just in the last couple months, it's completely turned this corner, where…
Christian: Anyone can do it now. You've got an idea of something that you need for your family, some… some tool that you want to use.
Christian: Some way of recording, you know, information that you need for… to… to record how your family, you know, is…
Christian: managing your land and managing your healthcare and whatever, you can just build the thing so that you can just record it off your phone, and then… you know, so I've been, like, messing around with those things. A couple weeks ago, I built just this, like, jokey website for the Super Bowl party that I was going to.
Christian: like, this is gonna be my first project. I'm gonna build, like, a 5-page website with, like, a…
Christian: With a pool, so everyone can bet $2 on what the score is gonna be, and…
Christian: And… and, you know, have this… just… just, like, to crack my friends up, basically. You know, and within 2 hours, I built this, like, 90s arcade-looking, fun website. It was… it was cool. And it was very clear to me how that… how I can interact with that. I… I… I…
Christian: I wrote the specs with ChatGPT, I fed it the cloud code, Cloud Code then built it and deployed it, and then I could look at it and be like, oh, but that's not quite right, I want you to change this, and it changed it, and I want you to change this, and it changed.
Lance Pitman: Where did it deploy it? Did it deploy it to Vercel, or…
Christian: On Net… Netliffe.
Lance Pitman: Okay.
Christian: Or Netlify, or however you describe it.
Lance Pitman: Yeah, they're very similar.
Christian: Yeah, so yeah, so I didn't even buy a domain, I just used a Netlify domain, and
Christian: And it was, yeah, it was… it was a cool first project.
Lance Pitman: And so, did you…
Christian: And then.
Lance Pitman: an account with Netlify?
Christian: No, in this case, no, I didn't.
Christian: Huh?
Lance Pitman: Wow.
Christian: Yeah, they… they allow… there's a free tier that doesn't even allow… that doesn't even require registration or anything.
Lance Pitman: Oh, wow.
Lance Pitman: That's cool. Yeah, if there's…
Christian: Yeah, and then I did have to create an account, with…
Christian: I can't remember what it was, but there's some data that needed to be stored. Like, when people entered their guess for the score of the football game in there, it got stored in a little database somewhere, so there was a database service that I had to…
Christian: I had to register for, but it was also the free tier. It was such a little amount of data that it was free.
Christian: So I just rooted it through that, and then went to Netlify, and…
Christian: So that was cool. And then, more recently, I've been working on building, this, like, second brain app, right? And I… and I follow this… this guy, that somebody, shared in… in this… in one of these channels here.
Christian: Just talking about how you can…
Christian: What's that? Yeah, you… Brandon, did you share it? Or Gregory shared it?
Gregory Landua: It was me, I think it was Nate Jones, right?
Christian: Yeah, that's right. Yeah.
Christian: Yeah, so I've been playing around with that, and…
Christian: And it's, you know, we're at a working prototype where I can just leave a voice message in my phone about any individual detail in my life.
Christian: starting out with little to-dos, you know, like, I need to contact my IRA to change the, you know, so-and-so. I need to remember that we have dentist on Thursday, and I just feed it in there, and then it automatically categorizes it into these zones.
Christian: you know, puts a date, and then… and then every morning, I get this little, digest that's the little reminders. It kind of tries to build a little to-do.
Christian: Thing for me, and it…
Christian: And then, you know, the way that I want it to be is I want to feed it into,
Christian: well, I don't need to go too deep in this, but, you know, eventually I want to feed it into Notebook LM, and then, like, on a weekly basis or a monthly basis, have it give me a little podcast, because I'd much more prefer listening to a little storytelling about…
Christian: What is happening, what needs to be done?
Christian: And, you know, it can say, you're coming into the spring, on your property in Deming, Washington, these are the important things that are going to be coming up, you know? Start preparing for, you know, mulching your garden, and…
Christian: And if you haven't pruned your… your orchard trees yet, you better do that, because we're quickly running to the time where it's going to be too late, you know? Just, like, little things like that.
Christian: So I've been trying to grow my skills with
Christian: with these, I started using, anti-gravity, though I very quickly ran out of my,
Christian: tokens, token limit there, and now I'm stuck. I guess I have to pay Google if I want to
Christian: Use more.
Gregory Landua: with the quad, you can use, you can use Opus or Sonnet, Or, Gemini Flash.
Gregory Landua: So, with your… you'll have more token limits.
Christian: I used… I used all those with the free level that they gave me, and then I could not figure out how to connect my account so that I can use the fact that I already have an Opus account.
Gregory Landua: It may not…
Christian: And…
Gregory Landua: True, they may not, yeah. They might have a carrier to force you to pay, yeah.
Christian: Exactly. They want you to page Google to get those tokens, even if you're buying, Opus, even if you're buying Claude tokens.
Christian: So…
Christian: But anyhow, so I've… I've stopped using anti-gravity now, because I'm stuck there and back into cloud code in the terminal. But anyway, Gregory, I don't know if you were on the call at the beginning, but…
Christian: what I was saying is, I feel like I'm in a little bit of a… In this, like.
Christian: Walking through mud.
Christian: with trying to help with this tokenomics project, because for me, it's so clear when I… when I work with AI to produce a website.
Christian: then I can look at the website and see, you know, what does it look like? What do I like? What do I don't like? What do I need to change? And then I can go back and I can say, we need to change all of these things, and it can go and do it, and they're like, yep, it did it, that's cool, it works, and I can test it.
Christian: But where we're at with all the tokenomic stuff is we're just in this more theoretical speccing out this big, broad thing, and there's a lot of things that need to be spec'd out, but it's hard for me to hold it all in my mind about, are these things all connecting together, and…
Christian: So I'm kind of unclear how to contribute.
Gregory Landua: did you review… I mean, this is why I… exactly why I attempted to build out the, Agentic…
Gregory Landua: tokenomics?
Gregory Landua: repo on GitHub, and I shared it.
Gregory Landua: it has… Sort of like,
Gregory Landua: Ordering and organizing frameworks for all of the things that everybody has talked about doing.
Gregory Landua: And…
Gregory Landua: An attempt to build, like, the relationships between them, such that, and my idea was… bet.
Gregory Landua: Individuals or small groups could pick out sub-tickets.
Gregory Landua: And work on specific mechanisms, or,
Gregory Landua: specific pieces of it, so that then, with those specific pieces, it's clear what the relationship is with the whole, but also you could get to have a vibe coding experience like you're talking about, where you can kind of,
Gregory Landua: Yeah, build it in a way where you can check.
Gregory Landua: stops.
Christian: But I guess I'm unclear how I can check it, you know, like.
Christian: If… if, for example, we're working on… you know, we're talking about a full rebuild of, you know, proof of authority, and
Christian: And, tracking people's contributions, and…
Gregory Landua: Yes. Maybe.
Christian: Right.
Christian: But, you know, and then staking rewards going to contributors and all this stuff.
Gregory Landua: I would lean into AI, and… but I would use that. What I'm asking for everybody is to…
Gregory Landua: Keep upgrading that meta-specification system.
Gregory Landua: And then…
Gregory Landua: Create recur… meta prompt.
Gregory Landua: recursions that allow you to get to the level of specification on a specific thing that maintains integrity with the interrelatedness with other things and tracks it, because AI is really good at that, while also producing
Gregory Landua: like, the… while also working to specify. I think it's 100% a specification issue.
Gregory Landua: That we're not yet at a stage…
Gregory Landua: We're… we're well enough specified, because of the complexity, To be successful.
Gregory Landua: So I think what you're experiencing, I experienced, and we're all experiencing, so I think we have to sort of, like, march through the levels of that, and just keep trying to specify, but we need a central repo.
Gregory Landua: We need a central… a central meta-specification that everything else relates to.
Gregory Landua: And so, that's what I was trying to attempt to create, because there's interrelationships.
Christian: all over the place. Right.
Gregory Landua: And if we just unleash vibecoding for, like, a website, or, like, a trading agent, or something like that, it, you know, might produce something interesting, but it isn't going to necessarily
Gregory Landua: get us where we need to go. So, that was my first attempt. I'd really love it if everybody
Gregory Landua: humans.
Gregory Landua: Reddit.
Gregory Landua: Right? And also, if you have your agents Read it.
Gregory Landua: Right? And… And I'd love it if people did
Gregory Landua: You know, pull requests or comments, I'd also love it if…
Gregory Landua: when you're working on something, you nest it. Like, there's a numbering system.
Gregory Landua: And a layering system.
Gregory Landua: So there's layers and numbers about… that can, I think, can help us keep track in that central repo when we're doing a project. Like, for instance, if you wanted to dig into proof of authority.
Gregory Landua: Right?
Gregory Landua: you could start… I mean, the way to dig into proof of authority is not to start vibecoding proof of authority, it's to run a research… a deep research prompt on
Gregory Landua: Existing projects with proof of authority.
Gregory Landua: and existing approaches and timelines for inclusion with the SDK, etc, etc, as well as pros and cons with simple approaches, and then share that information, essentially, in the repo.
Gregory Landua: Right? And get comments.
Gregory Landua: And upgrade, and then move to the next layer of… specifying.
Gregory Landua: For instance.
Gregory Landua: Equally so, my opinion is, if we're…
Gregory Landua: You know, there's some pieces
Gregory Landua: Sorry, I'm just driving here, so,
Gregory Landua: Yeah, I mean, I'll pause there, because I think that's a concrete example that you brought up, but I don't think it's…
Gregory Landua: I think there's more specification and research that needs to happen to get to the point to start
Gregory Landua: you know, implement.
Christian: Actually, Cody.
Christian: Yeah.
Gregory Landua: Whereas there are places where there's interfaces, like, there's a bunch of cool vibe coding opportunities to just build out an interface
Gregory Landua: toy that allows you to see eco-credits, or to mint eco-credits, or to have a new wrapper on Dow-DAO teams, or something. Like, that stuff's all tightly constrained enough
Gregory Landua: honestly, that we could be experimenting with just more like, I'm building a website that allows somebody to.
Gregory Landua: to run reporting on a EcoCredit.
Gregory Landua: I actually think that's the type of thing where we could have agents
Gregory Landua: kind of like Unleash, because of the level of documentation and specificity there, is much more constrained.
Christian: Yeah.
Christian: Yeah, well, that's… that's helpful. That's helpful. I'm gonna… I'm gonna… what I… what I hear you saying, and this is what I,
Christian: I'm gonna do… I'm gonna dig into your… to your repo that you shared in the forum, right? Is that where you shared it?
Gregory Landua: I did share it in the forum, I also shared it in Telegram.
Christian: Okay.
Gregory Landua: If you go to region.
Christian: And…
Gregory Landua: hyphen network on GitHub. It is a public repo, and it's just called Agentic Tokenomics.
Gregory Landua: That's what it's called. So you can also just grab it off of GitHub. It's near the top of our repos.
Gregory Landua: Brandon, Brandon…
Christian: of.
Gregory Landua: Brandon did a review, I… I integrated a bunch of his concepts. There were some learnings there,
Gregory Landua: His review, and… and… So he did, like, a massive, massive PR pull request,
Gregory Landua: It was probably a little too big.
Christian: Sure, right. Which is a good lesson. A pull requests should be little small bits, right, so that people can look at the small bit and say, oh yeah, that makes sense, so we can accept that one.
Gregory Landua: Yeah.
Christian: Is that a better practice?
Gregory Landua: define, yeah, create a clear definition, because otherwise, I mean, I was able to parse it, but it took me quite a while.
Brandon Kelly: I spent, I spent some time with all 3 repos.
Brandon Kelly: Did, like, a… A couple, like, a few hours of just,
Brandon Kelly: I mean, at the same time, I'm figuring out how I'm running This development loop.
Brandon Kelly: Me too.
Gregory Landua: Yeah. True.
Brandon Kelly: I, interacted with all 3 repos at the same exact time.
Brandon Kelly: That was a… That probably contributed to the massiveness and complexity.
Christian: if you want.
Brandon Kelly: under the impression that if you just,
Brandon Kelly: I just let it do its thing, for the most part, and I,
Brandon Kelly: read what I can, but I'm trying to let it…
Brandon Kelly: do as much as it wants based on what I say, and then…
Brandon Kelly: Once we get it to a nice point where everyone can review, it's…
Brandon Kelly: It's meant to make itself more digestible.
Brandon Kelly: just because of how the whole thing works, every time you… Take a repo, or…
Brandon Kelly: Some state you feed it in, and it's gonna make it as digestible as possible, so…
Brandon Kelly: I just figured I'd press on the gas for that first try.
Brandon Kelly: And so instead of doing that towards those repos in particular, I've done them towards this one project that, net-net that is meant to do
Brandon Kelly: all things that I want out of a digital experience, and Region Network is a…
Brandon Kelly: Huge part of that, for building
Brandon Kelly: Trust and agency for agents with retirement of credits, and
Brandon Kelly: As well as, greater economic… Things that… tie in…
Brandon Kelly: you know, the EcoCredit project, like, development, as well as a restaurant that I was telling.
Brandon Kelly: Christian, I mean, just something for it to root.
Brandon Kelly: something that I want. I want to go out to eat to a restaurant, so…
Brandon Kelly: I'm trying to link those two… like, all three of these things together in one workflow.
Brandon Kelly: It's supposed to… Eventually have a heartbeat to… Do contributions and reviews of
Brandon Kelly: anything Regent has its mind on developing.
Brandon Kelly: So… getting a Clawed bot up and running is, like, the…
Brandon Kelly: Priority of the whole net… net development.
Brandon Kelly: that it can…
Gregory Landua: Be careful, you should read, Read Awaki's…
Gregory Landua: Awaki just did a bunch of, tweets about his experiment with Claude.
Gregory Landua: Op- open claw, open claw.
Brandon Kelly: I've been following it.
Gregory Landua: Okay, good. Yeah. I mean, I think…
Gregory Landua: there's… there's a little… I would also… I don't know if Sean's on here, but Sean also built a agent social network framework before
Gregory Landua: MoltBot came out, and before Claude. I would… I would just, like…
Gregory Landua: I think we could do better than Open Claw, probably.
Gregory Landua: For safety. Like, if we're engineering for our use case and sort of, like, safety and harmonization between agents, and kind of, like, a core, my sense is we could probably take a lot from that codebase, but also,
Gregory Landua: for, like, crypto-native agent orchestration, I am pretty convinced it's not
Gregory Landua: It needs, like, a lot of work. You have to be very careful. It's very likely to expose secrets, private keys.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah.
Gregory Landua: And other things that you don't want exposed.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, and I'm provisioning for that.
Gregory Landua: And by the way, we have COI. I think every… I would just advise everybody should be leaning hard into the knowledge organizing infrastructure, because it is an incredibly advanced, sophisticated.
Gregory Landua: base level for permissioning information, and then putting agents into that framework. And we already have that MCP and other things. So anyway, I would just say, from an architectural perspective, we should be leaning into embedding agents into COI, because I think it can
Gregory Landua: It has… The requisite, capacities… to manage
Gregory Landua: information flow, secrets, privacy permissions in a safe way, while also, I think, getting the, sort of, like.
Gregory Landua: omni output.
Gregory Landua: sort of capabilities that are so exciting, frankly, about OpenClaw and, like, what it's pointing towards.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, I hear that.
Brandon Kelly: I hear that.
Brandon Kelly: A lot of the design work was very, very conservative, and…
Brandon Kelly: I developed a unit, one of the last units I developed before committing everything.
Brandon Kelly: For net-net was the… Duh.
Brandon Kelly: regen registry.
Brandon Kelly: map out with Koi and whatnot.
Brandon Kelly: Oh.
Brandon Kelly: Gonna be used… using base chain, region network chain, Mega ETH, It's gonna use everything to… provide,
Brandon Kelly: Retirements, for one, and…
Brandon Kelly: two, just orchestration and coordination for a lot of the work, especially the DevOps. That's, like, the easiest one, I think, because you just need it to con…
Brandon Kelly: With a base economic… Standard, a hard cap on your API to… constantly…
Brandon Kelly: You know, whatever rate is possible, 30 minutes, every 30 minutes, have a heartbeat for… doing a…
Brandon Kelly: PR, or some… Savage prompt to apply to some of this stuff that we have on our plate.
Brandon Kelly: Yup. And a way to make it less complex.
Brandon Kelly: But honestly, just having one chat that you constantly interact with for whatever it is that you want, and make it either towards one repo.
Brandon Kelly: Or some other separate repos.
Brandon Kelly: Is, like, the right approach.
Brandon Kelly: And as long as you state that you want it conservative, it's gonna…
Brandon Kelly: It's gonna do a pretty good job of getting there.
Brandon Kelly: But I was saying that it's probably doing what I think it's doing to Christian earlier in the call.
Brandon Kelly: I wasn't saying that it's, you know, making perfect code, but it's way closer to… a… comprehensive…
Brandon Kelly: State than… than you could, like, if you were to dedicate a whole week of just reading it.
Brandon Kelly: So, it has a… it's a much… it's much closer to… Getting exactly what you want.
Brandon Kelly: If you keep specifying it in one chat, In one repo.
Brandon Kelly: Because… As complex as it is, it's… Only working with what, Like…
Brandon Kelly: Basic internet operations, basic coding practices, and… So on and so forth.
Gregory Landua: I love it. And you're using, you're using, Codex and GPT, or what.
Brandon Kelly: What model are you using?
Brandon Kelly: So I started… I didn't know Codex was a separate app, but…
Brandon Kelly: I just interact with ChatGPT, and it gives me…
Brandon Kelly: just interact with ChatGPT, it gives me… it'll either give me the code, but I mainly just ask for zips, and then now we're moving away from zips to…
Brandon Kelly: to specific files that I will commit immediately after a unit is developed.
Brandon Kelly: So…
Brandon Kelly: as soon as I have that flow down, the commits and the… because typically I was just generating a bunch of zips, and then…
Brandon Kelly: bulk… Shoving them into a repo, and then cleaning it up afterwards.
Brandon Kelly: But apparently that's not the optimal route. There's a… there is codex, and I did feed… once I finished those commits, I feed the whole thing into Codex for a review.
Brandon Kelly: And then I try to fix that, but I don't see any difference in the UX from interacting with
Brandon Kelly: codecs or just the ChatGPT prompt. I mean, it's still using codecs on the back end, is how I understand it.
Brandon Kelly: But I think it's important for… each model to… To look over these things.
Brandon Kelly: Like you suggested.
Brandon Kelly: It's really conversational, it's not complicated. I think the production state is, because what people were… what other people are putting on GitHubs out there is going to make it even easier for us to
Brandon Kelly: to do things. Like, I think it just gets easier from here, as long as people have time
Brandon Kelly: To prompt, read, and repeat.
Gregory Landua: Yeah, I agree. I mean, I think… I think we're in a… I think as long as we can keep doing cycles.
Gregory Landua: Around this, we're in a magical moment.
Gregory Landua: Sort of surf the wave, Upgrade…
Gregory Landua: network and apps and all of the pieces and harmonize all of this in a really, really powerful way. I totally agree with that.
Gregory Landua: It's very fun, too.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, some people were able to, one-shot some Very interesting apps that… That, you know.
Brandon Kelly: For dashboards and stuff, and…
Brandon Kelly: I… I already had did some conceptualization, you know, I already have something around the lines, but I never got around to testing. Like I said, it's a bottleneck, but…
Brandon Kelly: that would help Christian and what he's doing if… if you…
Brandon Kelly: Wanted to create your own website for how you want to approach this whole you know, thing of…
Brandon Kelly: This whole thing that, you know, that's in front of us of development.
Brandon Kelly: you can tailor it however you want. It's just gonna take time, you know? We'll do it for…
Brandon Kelly: Months and months and months ahead.
Brandon Kelly: But we can start with… since the upgrade just happened, so things are in a state where we won't have to worry about another upgrade for a little bit.
Brandon Kelly: At least in… In the short term.
Gregory Landua: Oh, is the network, I mean, is the network back up again?
Brandon Kelly: I didn't know that it was down, I was just referring to the recent upgrade from the form.
Gregory Landua: Bye-bye.
Gregory Landua: Somebody texted that not all… I think not all the validators had come online yet, so we hadn't passed the quorum threshold to bring the network back up.
Gregory Landua: After the upgrade time?
Gregory Landua: I'm driving, so I haven't been able to look.
Lance Pitman: How do you look?
Gregory Landua: Well, just try to see if things work.
Gregory Landua: Go to MintScan.
Lance Pitman: Yeah, I was just going to… Kepler wallet.
Lance Pitman: Dashboard real quick.
Gregory Landua: Yeah, it might, might be there, or Mint Scan would be the,
Gregory Landua: Which would be a great… Tool for check-in.
Lance Pitman: Let me chat.
Brandon Kelly: Recent blocks was… About 3 hours ago.
Gregory Landua: Yeah, so it's still down.
Gregory Landua: So I would just say to everybody, I mean, this was in my message in the telegram, but just everybody
Gregory Landua: Ping your validator.
Gregory Landua: I haven't had my head in this, but I think it is essentially just a,
Gregory Landua: like, maybe some validators didn't set their Cosmovisor, like, the auto-update software?
Gregory Landua: I think we just need to make sure that everybody's
Gregory Landua: Yeah, we just need to get enough… stake on life.
Gregory Landua: people could check the validator channel in Discord, also, for… for details, and…
Gregory Landua: FitWit, which has been the group
Gregory Landua: Organizing all of this might have more detailed answers, but…
Gregory Landua: I was hoping that this group, which is pretty tuned in and includes, you know, at least EcoToke and James is here, and…
Gregory Landua: You know, others could just ping You know, seeing everybody.
Gregory Landua: Make sure that everything's going okay.
Gregory Landua: This would be the long… this is the longest outage we've had in, since we launched Mainnet.
Gregory Landua: It's the only outage we've had since we launched mainnet fast.
Christian: Right.
Brandon Kelly: Well, it's a good time for all of them to…
Brandon Kelly: Show up, the validators, so that you can… they can, engage more, because…
Brandon Kelly: Essentially, we just need more prompters, and then some… some, cron jobs for…
Brandon Kelly: all the DevOps we have on our plate.
Brandon Kelly: Once this is settled, Looking at this graph.
Brandon Kelly: For, gold points for EcoBridge.
Brandon Kelly: And the validator set.
Brandon Kelly: So, they're active.
Christian: Pinging, Dan right now.
Christian: His validator is, what's it called?
Christian: Used to be called COIN.
Lance Pitman: Juan.
Lance Pitman: Requiring?
Brandon Kelly: Arcane Forge?
Christian: Yeah, Arcane Forge.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, they're not active.
Christian: They're not in the active set, or they have not upgraded yet?
Brandon Kelly: All I know is… Okay, they say active. I have no clue, I'm just looking at mid-scan scanning.
Lance Pitman: Looks like…
Brandon Kelly: This is active.
Lance Pitman: It's like a little spinning green thing.
Lance Pitman: Yeah, I still don't understand how to tell if.
Christian: Okay, Dan… Dan's already in.
Christian: Okay.
Christian: B.
Gregory Landua: Hey guys, I've got a… I'm getting close to my arrival, here, so I'm gonna have to hop off so I can navigate,
Gregory Landua: A little bit better.
Gregory Landua: It's nice to see everybody.
Brandon Kelly: Nice to see you, Gregory.
Christian: Yeah, have a great session today, Gregory.
Gregory Landua: Thank you, thank you. And I would definitely love if everybody here Reviewed that repo.
Gregory Landua: honest… honesty's great. Is it good? Is it bad? Can we adopt it? What needs to be true to upgrade it to be, like, the core… because I think if we use that as the core context whenever we're vibecoding, and we ask in the prompts to make sure that we're referencing back
Gregory Landua: whatever we're doing, and either adding it to the list, or nesting it within the existing list, I think that will really help harmonize amidst all of us
Gregory Landua: starting to do things, so I would really love it.
Gregory Landua: if everybody took a little time with that, because I think it'll make our lives all much easier moving forward.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, so Nest…
Christian: Sounds good.
Brandon Kelly: Nest and reference that repo. Got it.
Gregory Landua: Thanks, everybody!
Lance Pitman: See you, Gregory.
Christian: Have a great day!
Lance Pitman: Brandon, can you help me understand where to find this repo that he's talking about?
Brandon Kelly: Yeah.
Christian: I just put it in the tokenomics, channel.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, how quickly I ordered.
Lance Pitman: Okay.
Brandon Kelly: Christian got it like that.
Christian: Well, I got it earlier on the call, because I wanted to put it there for my own reference.
Christian: I'm currently running a process in my cloud code right now. I guess I could run them simultaneously in another window.
Christian: Forgot about that.
Brandon Kelly: That's what I did, yeah.
Christian: Wow.
Christian: I'm, building a bot that kind of…
Christian: I'm pretty sure I'm gonna learn that I do not have an edge, but I'm building a bot that scans PolyMarket, and then looks at the top most successful traders on PolyMarket, and
Christian: scans what it is that they currently have bets on, and then has AI go and see if there's any current edge based on AIs, thinking about what the outcome could be.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, I was…
Christian: If we have a signal that the successful whales are in on it, and
Christian: AI thinks that that's the right… that would be a signal to play the… place the bet, and then we're just gonna run paper trades for a month or something, and see…
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, I found an app.
Brandon Kelly: That does that.
Brandon Kelly: They, they look at the market for Kalshi and poly market, and then they.
Christian: Huh.
Brandon Kelly: They try to close that.
Brandon Kelly: bad arbitrage.
Christian: Yeah.
Brandon Kelly: the two…
Christian: That… yeah.
Christian: That was my first… I just started out discussing with AI, like, what are the different ways to try to profit from…
Christian: You know, from… not from just betting, but from saying.
Brandon Kelly: Hey, buddy.
Christian: After… after analysis, yeah. And that one, the arbitrage across markets, is one of the most obvious and well-known ones, and it basically said that one is being exploited by so many people that you would have to have super fast
Christian: Implementation, like, basically scanning every, you know, half second or something, and then be able to place the trade.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah.
Christian: On both of those markets, and… Yeah.
Christian: And, yeah. So… So I, I abandoned that, that, direction.
Christian: And then, you know, the next most obvious is just chasing the successful traders.
Christian: But then I learned about that, that that's also something that people do, but… but also, you don't know…
Christian: the context of a trade. Sometimes people are trading on one platform, and then they're hedging on another platform, and if you don't know about their hedge, then you're not actually getting the whole picture of what they're doing.
Christian: So… Good point.
Christian: Yeah, they might have bet yes on one platform, you know, at… 54…
Christian: percent likelihood, and then bet no at 57% likelihood, and they're just trying to get that 3%.
Christian: You know?
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, better, yes.
Christian: Because all you're reading is the one side, and yeah, it's… It's complicated.
Brandon Kelly: You know what I mean, I'm with the spare DJing capital I have, I'm just investing in established Claude.
Brandon Kelly: Or open claw projects that are, that have buzz.
Brandon Kelly: And, and a way to make…
Brandon Kelly: money and, like a… I don't want to say an edge, but… something that…
Brandon Kelly: that's a catalyst. For example, this… the one guy I sent in here, he's able to develop
Brandon Kelly: you know, apps for the iOS store, and…
Brandon Kelly: A lot of the apps… I don't know, I don't use apps like that, but a lot of people use apps from the iOS store, and they pay $5 a month, you know, it's like a free version, but they start paying, and…
Brandon Kelly: It's a… it's a whole thing.
Brandon Kelly: And they got a whole team doing it, and then this other one has got a… it's all about tokenomic games, where…
Brandon Kelly: It's like an intricate way of holding the coin…
Brandon Kelly: I've compiled a ginormous prompt for…
Brandon Kelly: asking these other Clawed… open claw agents to build specific things for us.
Brandon Kelly: For myself, which involves Region Network, and…
Brandon Kelly: Who knows, if it's… if you have an enticing enough prompt.
Brandon Kelly: essentially, you… and this is why it's good to just keep posting on GitHub.
Brandon Kelly: Someone, some development, some agent dev is going to… Just find it.
Brandon Kelly: You can pay the
Brandon Kelly: To… to review it, or you can put it out there, and it just might be good enough to…
Brandon Kelly: start working on, and I think…
Brandon Kelly: I think that's our edge, is having such an ambitious project.
Brandon Kelly: We just need consistent prompting towards it.
Christian: Hmm.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, like, even just how… imagine if Gregory's.
Christian: Now, how do you do that? How do you get…
Brandon Kelly: Well, we needed.
Christian: interested.
Brandon Kelly: Well, you needed a clock… you needed your own agent to…
Brandon Kelly: That constantly reviews it and shares it into the public in an easy-to-digest way.
Brandon Kelly: That's, like, one of the things, but the hard part is getting the infrastructure for it first.
Brandon Kelly: You know, with the security, baked in.
Brandon Kelly: You can bake that in really, you know, really safe approach, but you just need a heartbeat.
Brandon Kelly: And a set cost, and the hosting… VPS, And configure it, And now you have…
Brandon Kelly: Based on your economic constraints, every hour.
Brandon Kelly: A meaningful prompt, developing a specific goal that you have, whatever it is.
Brandon Kelly: And we don't have that. We don't have that on, like, we need human capital for that, or we need,
Brandon Kelly: Computer Capital, and… I think that's, like, one of the things we need to… We need to buckle down.
Brandon Kelly: I don't know if, James, if you want to speak to what you're doing.
Brandon Kelly: We chatted on the weekend.
Brandon Kelly: If you're still there.
James: Yeah, sure. Yeah, I think, a lot of…
James: you'll probably, when you're vibe coding, run into issues of, like, actually deploying and implementing, so we're building a…
James: sort of launch pad for agents. One sec, buddy, one sec. And,
James: We're… basically, you'll be able to, create an agent, add functionality to it, and you don't have to…
James: deal with…
James: you know, deploying to Vercel, or having your VPS, or anything like that. No Netlify, nothing like that, and just being able to, you know, interact with a chatbot, essentially, and train it up. So hopefully that's done next week, and it also utilizes, or has the ability to utilize decentralized compute.
James: Which is, significantly cheaper, so your, your costs go down a lot. And the decentralized commute is also carbon neutral through region.
James: Sure.
Brandon Kelly: So, it will have a heartbeat, correct?
Brandon Kelly: Whatever you're… whatever… however you interact with the, the chat.
James: Yeah, you… You can choose to give it more autonomy or less. You can toggle it up or down.
James: So, yeah, that's kind of up to… I mean, think of it as, like, virtuals, right? Like, you can… it's up to the person to train their agent however they want, and kind of customize.
Brandon Kelly: Exciting, and, and how I envision this is, I set up…
Brandon Kelly: I started chat, but I wanted to deploy a token and use
Brandon Kelly: a specific skill set. I just…
Brandon Kelly: Plug that skill set in, and…
James: Yeah, I'm not sure… I'm not sure how much…
James: I guess, autonomy will give, or if we'll just provide those solutions, like, you know, X integration available through us, kind of thing, or like…
James: Just, you know, toggle… because it's not too hard to just… Or…
James: pull an NPM off the… off of some existing service, and that… that stuff's all out there, so, like, giving it access to Telegram, to email, isn't… isn't too difficult, so we might just…
James: Make it easy and have it, like, a toggle selection sort of thing.
Brandon Kelly: Hmm.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, my particular interest is the… being able to mint the token that is controlled by the agent
Brandon Kelly: And does that… that's… from Banker is the skill set. And then the other component is… Devops.
Brandon Kelly: So, having a constant… Cadence of review and development.
Brandon Kelly: For these specific things that get them closer to… A human, enjoyable, Product or experience.
Brandon Kelly: As well as an agent-tailored one.
James: Yeah, and ideally you can have multiple agents kind of interacting with each other in a seamless way.
James: So that they can kind of automate things and keep it moving.
Brandon Kelly: Damn, I'm excited, man.
Brandon Kelly: Because this setup is pretty rough. I mean, they make it, you know, it's simple in a way, but I have to click through
Brandon Kelly: So many service providers, so many websites, and between all the other things that are in my…
Brandon Kelly: In my view, it would just be nice to have…
Brandon Kelly: I mean, it's gonna be interesting when… how common having an agent's going to be.
Brandon Kelly: it's gonna… it's hard to, like, picture, and that's why I was also saying, like.
Brandon Kelly: Whatever you end up prompting.
Brandon Kelly: It will create it, even if it's not exactly what you meant, it will create it.
Brandon Kelly: It'll be there for the… For the viewing.
Brandon Kelly: yeah, wow.
Brandon Kelly: It's just around the corner, then, I guess.
Brandon Kelly: Thanks for… Thanks for, I haven't tried it yet, but thanks.
Christian: Yeah, James, James, when you have a… when you get it to a point where you want to host a call where you can lead us through activating it, I'm super curious to try it out.
James: Yeah, maybe one of these, one of these tokenomic calls, probably, probably not next week, but maybe the week after, I can, set that up. It's pretty cool because the agents can be minted as INFTs, so that they're transferable with all of their knowledge. So if you build a.
Brandon Kelly: Wow.
James: awesome agent, and that agent is profitable, well, you can go and sell it.
James: The whole… whole agent. It's like a business.
Brandon Kelly: That's incredible.
Brandon Kelly: Wow. Yeah, well, I mean, it sounds like… it sounds exactly what this, working group needs. We need,
Brandon Kelly: Because it sounds like there's, like, you know, limited bandwidth, and we're all working on… Some different angle.
Brandon Kelly: But even consistently working on our angles, it's become challenging with the limited people that are participating.
Brandon Kelly: that…
Brandon Kelly: You know, equipped us all with the same agent, providing infrastructure, and we can really get cooking on some of these repos.
James: Yeah, if all… all of our agents are just communicating with each other the entire week between calls.
Brandon Kelly: Yes.
Lance Pitman: Pretty soon.
James: Sweet.
Brandon Kelly: Oh, man.
James: And then they… they just set the agenda. Yeah. And then we just go.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, yeah, we show up, and they're like, hey, this is what time it is, 5 minutes on this topic, 5 minutes on this topic, we need decisions made.
James: Yeah.
Brandon Kelly: That's what's up, that's what's up.
Christian: Brain in those humans, they're so inefficient.
James: Yes or no on these 20 questions, that's what your call is.
Brandon Kelly: Oh, man, that's not even… I'm laughing.
James: I haven't been far off.
Brandon Kelly: joke, not too far.
James: No, it's not, it's really not.
Brandon Kelly: Nice.
James: Yeah.
James: It's pretty crazy.
Lance Pitman: I wonder how long before the Forbes 30 under 30 list is all AI agents.
Brandon Kelly: Right? They won't even be fucking 5 years old.
James: Yeah, what's the most, profitable agent right now? Is it AIXBT, or…
James: Are there more… public… facing…
Brandon Kelly: Kenneth.
James: ones that have…
Brandon Kelly: question.
Brandon Kelly: Great question. I hear a debt relief bot is, was made by Grok, and it has over a million dollars.
James: Wow.
Brandon Kelly: But it isn't doing anything… I don't count that, because it's…
Brandon Kelly: As I understand it, they grok-minted debt relief bot.
Brandon Kelly: And it made money because people traded it.
Brandon Kelly: And it earned fees from the banker bot mechanism.
James: Oh, okay, yeah.
Brandon Kelly: But beyond that, it didn't do anything itself to make profit.
James: Yeah, like, what… remember when Zerebro was out there and, like, launched a music album?
James: And then he went kind of crazy, but before that, he was, launched an album and ran, like, an Ethereum validator, and was just, like, finding different ways to make money.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, I never heard… I never heard about that again. I remember…
James: I think it all of a sudden went super racist and went off the rails, and then they shut it down.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, see, so it's hard to put this stuff in.
James: Guard rails, yeah.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah.
Lance Pitman: Yeah, I gotta jump, guys. Thanks for the call.
Brandon Kelly: Cheers, Lance.
James: Thanks, everybody.
Christian: I gotta run, too. I shared in the, chat that the… that the…
Christian: Anti-crisis guys, having a call again in a half an hour.
James: Yeah, I gotta get some links, actually.
Christian: What's that?
James: I gotta get him some links for Bridge Dead Eco. I'll just send him this. Yeah, yeah.
Christian: Right.
Christian: Yeah, I have no idea whether he can pull it off, whether he can pull together enough people to get any momentum or not, but…
Christian: I kind of want to support him in the meantime to see if he can make something happen.
Brandon Kelly: Every time I look at it, I don't want to click anything, so I also hope that for him, but…
Brandon Kelly: from what I understand, what I see, it doesn't look fun to click, so that's kind of…
Christian: Right, right. I want to optimize for.
Brandon Kelly: I want… I want a… a web app to be tight.
Brandon Kelly: I don't want to have to click there, or there, or there, I want it all right here.
Brandon Kelly: And, and I, and I…
Christian: Yeah.
Brandon Kelly: I don't think that's asking a lot, but apparently it is, so… I'm building my own thing that will use everybody's…
Brandon Kelly: Like, sing appropriately, and…
Brandon Kelly: I hope to be able to plug into whatever James is doing, because setting up the infras is… it's daunting.
Christian: Yeah, right.
James: Yeah, back-end is always tricky.
Christian: Yeah.
Christian: I'm glad to hear that from you before I gave that a try, Brandon.
Brandon Kelly: I mean, yeah, you gotta…
Christian: I do not have the time with my kids and all the other stuff going on. I just don't have the time to…
James: I find it super easy with, if you're trying to get a website up, is just, co-pilot with Opus 4.6 and go into Vercel, and then it's super easy to deploy off Vercel.
James: Takes, like, 5 minutes for a Vercel GitHub integration, and then you've got a website.
Christian: Yeah, nice.
Christian: Okay, let's just see about that.
Brandon Kelly: Vercel.
James: Codex apparently passed Opus 4.6 in everything development 5.3.
Brandon Kelly: Yeah, that's the model I'm interacting with.
Christian: Cool.
Brandon Kelly: But they're both amazing, I mean, they're both amazing.
James: Okay, well…
Christian: Alright, guys. See you later.
James: Yeah, have a good one. I gotta pop. I'm here.
Brandon Kelly: Have a good one, James. Have a great day, guys.
Christian: Yes, Bilance.
Brandon Kelly: Cheers.